the last of us part II (potential spoilers ahead)

[MaXenzie]

Her actor was great but she seriously had zero charm and had like, zero unique qualities other than being swole. She's a dislikable character and equally is inherently a bad character in the sense that she feels out of place in the story and the fact you're forced to play as her.

Here are a few reasons why it's hard for me to care about her/not root for Ellie to kill Abby throughout the entire game:

Spoiler

1. Has the desire to kill a man for 4 years without any second thought, risking not only the lives of the people she brings with her to do so (which all die btw) but the WLF as a whole
2. Betrays the organization that kept her fed, sheltered, and roided and kills multiple of them. Additionally gets the WLF leader killed/injured
3. Fucks a drunk guy who has a pregnant girlfriend
4. Would have gladly killed a pregnant woman if not for Lev

i think abby could've been a great character

if she had no involvement with ellie or joel at all

 

[bubblegum]

Her actor was great but she seriously had zero charm and had like, zero unique qualities other than being swole. She's a dislikable character and equally is inherently a bad character in the sense that she feels out of place in the story and the fact you're forced to play as her.

Here are a few reasons why it's hard for me to care about her/not root for Ellie to kill Abby throughout the entire game:

Spoiler

1. Has the desire to kill a man for 4 years without any second thought, risking not only the lives of the people she brings with her to do so (which all die btw) but the WLF as a whole
2. Betrays the organization that kept her fed, sheltered, and roided and kills multiple of them. Additionally gets the WLF leader killed/injured
3. Fucks a drunk guy who has a pregnant girlfriend
4. Would have gladly killed a pregnant woman if not for Lev

She’s a piece of shit.

Spoiler

She’s a soldier who kills people without remorse and is blind by the dogma of her own group. It’s only through the kids does she do anything redeeming. The point about being so strong about revenge mirrors Ellie’s desire to do the same thing. Both Ellie and Abby have an insane need to get revenge on the person they feel wronged them and it gets their friend killed in the process. But I like her as a character even if she’s unlikeable as a person.

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One thing I've noticed is a lot of you who seem to like abby see the world in a very black and white kind of way

it’s just a game. I could say something equally generalizing about people who dislike her and it would make for unhealthy discourse.

 

[Blackquill]

Giving it a bit more thought I feel like there was a lot more potential for interactions between Joel and Abby like

I think they were going for some kind of 'reflection/mirror' metaphor since Joel lost his daughter and Abby lost her father. Maybe they were going for some kind of 'two sides of the same coin' thing. It's probably not a coinidence Abby ended up taking care of someone like Joel did with Ellie in TLOU1 but

IDK the execution seems off to me.

 

[Deleted member 28]

She’s a piece of shit.

Spoiler

She’s a soldier who kills people without remorse and is blind by the dogma of her own group. It’s only through the kids does she do anything redeeming. The point about being so strong about revenge mirrors Ellie’s desire to do the same thing. Both Ellie and Abby have an insane need to get revenge on the person they feel wronged them and it gets their friend killed in the process. But I like her as a character even if she’s unlikeable as a person.

Sure, I can agree that she definitely serves her purpose as a character. She accomplishes Druckmann's goal of making the player desire revenge, which is a central point of the game. I would have been perfectly fine with her existence if it didn't feel like the game was forcing us to like her or sympathize with her, primarily regarding how we have to play as her for half the game

Giving it a bit more thought I feel like there was a lot more potential for interactions between Joel and Abbey like

I think they were going for some kind of 'reflection/mirror' metaphor since Joel lost his daughter and Abby lost her father. Maybe they were going for some kind of 'two sides of the same coin' thing. It's probably not a coinidence Abby ended up taking care of someone like Joel did with Ellie in TLOU1 but

IDK the execution seems off to me.

This is part of it too. Maybe if they didn't kill off the most crucial character in the first game and 90% of all supporting characters by the end of this one, I certainly believe that a lot of engaging interactions could have taken place. Dunno how Druckmann can say these games are about love when everyone is killing and torturing each other

 

[MaXenzie]

Giving it a bit more thought I feel like there was a lot more potential for interactions between Joel and Abbey like

I think they were going for some kind of 'reflection/mirror' metaphor since Joel lost his daughter and Abby lost her father. Maybe they were going for some kind of 'two sides of the same coin' thing. It's probably not a coinidence Abby ended up taking care of someone like Joel did with Ellie in TLOU1 but

IDK the execution seems off to me.

Spoiler

its made all the worse since abby does it IMMEDIATELY after joel saves her life

if the game had abby reconsider her decisions because of him saving her, there'd be a lot more depth and nuance, even if she did go through with killing him at a later date

 

[bubblegum]

Maybe if they didn't kill off the most crucial character in the first game

Spoiler

His story was done. Imo it didn't feel cheap to me. It was impactful and clearly created an emotional response from people, otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Spoiler

its made all the worse since abby does it IMMEDIATELY after joel saves her life

if the game had abby reconsider her decisions because of him saving her, there'd be a lot more depth and nuance, even if she did go through with killing him at a later date

Spoiler

The audience is supposed to condemn Abby for this action. Her saving the kids and ditching Owen is her redemption arc.

 

[MaXenzie]

Spoiler

Spoiler

yeah the issue is that no amount of redemption will redeem her in most people's eyes

 

[Deleted member 28]

Spoiler

His story was done. Imo it didn't feel cheap to me. It was impactful and clearly created an emotional response from people, otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Spoiler

Honestly, I would have felt much better if he died in a way that at least stayed true to his character. Him making mistakes like blindly walking into a trap and giving his real name, of which he criticized Ellie for amongst other things, really doesn't make sense even if he's been living a relatively peaceful life. Those lessons are things you don't simply forget, especially considering they've saved his and Ellie's life multiple times as well as the fact that he patrols around the town and likely runs into bandits occasionally. Dumbing down his character because the writers can't think of anything more creative is disappointing

Also how does Tommy not see/care about Abby reaching for a shotgun? The more you look at these scenes and the logic behind them the more inconsistencies make themselves clear. I'm not saying the first game was flawless in this regard but it definitely wasn't this bad

 

[Powley]

Alright, played the game with a few friends over the part few days.

The story's still absolute garbo, even after sitting down and witnessing it not through a stream, I enjoy the Ellie and Dima dynamic, and Abby as a character has flaws but for the most part all characters fall flat and the writing is clearly rushed.

Gameplay is phenominal, reacts really well and some of the scenes like the subway chase are honestly amazing.

Graphics are a killer, looking over seatle is amazing and they really did a good number on the atmosphere of a overgrown city

Overall - 5.5, story means a lot to the last of us, and the story was weak. Its cool if you like the game but abbys agenda is just a shoehorn. Joel's story should've ended in a more dignified way. Abby and ellie are probably still alive so they can both return in druckmanns live theatre production of The last of us part 3

 

[Deleted member 28]

Abby and ellie are probably still alive so they can both return in druckmanns live theatre production of The last of us part 3

I can already see it. Abby and Lev go on this journey to find the fireflies and Ellie has some lame redemption arc that eventually results in her finding and befriending Abby. Lev probably dies along the way and the remaining two of them find the fireflies and Ellie heroically sacrifices herself to develop a vaccine, even though the doctors would realistically have everything they needed from her while she was alive

sigh

 

[Powley]

I can already see it. Abby and Lev go on this journey to find the fireflies and Ellie has some lame redemption arc that eventually results in her finding and befriending Abby. Lev probably dies along the way and the remaining two of them find the fireflies and Ellie heroically sacrifices herself to develop a vaccine, even though the doctors would realistically have everything they needed from her while she was alive

sigh

Also abby is the surgeon

Full circle bro

 

[Romeo]

it's here.

 

[Deleted member 28]

it's here.

The most anticipated review in the history of reviews

 

[Ond]

it's here.

For once I agree with 99% of what the guy is saying

 

[Blackquill]

Yahtzee also didn't like it, I'm a bit surprised I thought he'd like it since he didn't like the first game

 

[Ond]

Yahtzee also didn't like it, I'm a bit surprised I thought he'd like it since he didn't like the first game

the first game is objectively good but can just not be your cup of tea

if he liked the second game i'd be concerned

 

[Blackquill]

the first game is objectively good but can just not be your cup of tea

if he liked the second game i'd be concerned

I think my favourite line from his review was him basically saying

"characters getting the shit kicked out of them doesn't make them deep or complex"

 

[Trains]

I think my favourite line from his review was him basically saying

"characters getting the shit kicked out of them doesn't make them deep or complex"

the only show i know that this has kinda worked in is breaking bad

 

[Blackquill]

the only show i know that this has kinda worked in is breaking bad

No character in Breaking Bad has a personality/character who's sole purpose is getting the shit kicked out of them.

Like Jesse gets beat up a shit ton but that's not why he's a deep and complex character - that's reflected in shit like his love interests, conflicts with Walt (despite being partners in crime) and a lot of other stuff you can pick out.

 

[Trains]

No character in Breaking Bad has a character who's sole purpose is getting the shit kicked out of them.

Like Jesse gets beat up a shit ton but that's not why he's a deep and complex character - that's reflected in shit like his love interests, conflicts with Walt (despite being partners in crime) and a lot of other stuff you can pick out.

ye exactly

my point is, to me it helps you feel sympathetic towards him, because you know jesse tries his best to do well and be a good person and yet he can’t help but get the shit beat out of him and land in deep shit all the time

obviously there’s a lot more to it than that, but with tlou2 i feel like they kinda just assumed that “oh well likeable character getting beaten up = sympathy right guys”

but they forgot to make the character likeable omegalul